PODCAST JULIET ADDO
Paul ADEPOJU 00:00 An issue that I think is really obvious, we may argue that science in Africa is actually the research landscape that is still struggling. But when you look at the rapid advancements in infectious disease research, we seem to be seeing a lot of African researchers, especially in this space, publishing in High Impact Factor journals, and sometimes actually leading the rest of the world in some knowledge. So looking at these, how do you personally place the current status of Africa's science ecosystem, and looking at its potentials in contributing, and expanding the global body of knowledge?
Juliet Addo 00:44Okay, so thanks, Paul, I think you've brought in so many different aspects. So, I will take it from different aspects as I see fit. So, I think you make a point about African scientists, of course, leading the science in infectious diseases, in some instances and publishing in high impact journals. You are right, because a few years back, that might not have been the case, there were lots of collaborations going on. And lots of research is going on in infectious diseases, mostly funded by high income countries, or say, the global north, and there was an equal partnership. So, it almost felt as if it was led by the northern partner. But I think increasingly, African scientists are beginning to take ownership, and are beginning to lead and drive some of these collaborations. And I think that is a step in the right direction. But it seems to me like there is more that can be done, that we can increase our science, we can increase our research. And by that, I mean African scientists, and own it more. And to me, I see a gap in the early career research stage. So, there are lots of collaborations and a lot of well-known infectious disease experts that are leading the science. But if there is no effort to bring in mid-career, early career scientists, there might be a gap in that area. So, we need the innovation to continue. We need research leaders, the future research leaders, to also be brought in and take over and make sure that there's a succession plan and sustainability for research in Africa. So yes, we are doing the right things. We are owning our research, we are collaborating as we ought to, there could be more as well, in the sense that a lot of us are quite dependent on external funding, sometimes there is a lack of collaboration within the region itself, sometimes, and even within countries, sometimes there are research institutions that are not collaborating with each other even when they're working on the same topic. So, I think there's still some room for improvement. But definitely, over the past few years, we have seen an improvement. And I think one of the things I look at that can highlight this is the response to the COVID 19 pandemic, for example, and how African nations came together collaborated, made sure that we handled the epidemic well, and the genomics around it, and so on. So, I think basically, there is a lot of talent, there's a lot of skill, there is a lot of drive to make research, one of the key things that informs our development.
Paul ADEPOJU 03:27Yes, I'm really happy you mentioned early-stage science. In the first place, why do you think this is critical and how do you think this can be realistically done? Because I know there are lots of initiatives that are targeting early-stage scientists in Africa, lots of funding opportunities, lots of training, travel fellowships to international conferences, and lots of initiatives that are there. And the fact that the situation is from one African country, and probably one institution to another, or even one line of research to another, which could make it really complex. So how do you personally think this can be ideally achieved?
Juliet Addo 04:09We have seen this as a key gap, and no wonder as you mentioned there are lots of initiatives trying to address this, because this is a point maybe the postdoctoral period, or when people are just trying to find their feet in research and develop, there are probably not as many postdoctoral opportunities. So, they finish their PhDs, there aren't postdoctoral opportunities. There aren't labs that they can work in, there aren't sponsors or they don't get the right mentorship programs and so on. So, these are available. There are some available, there are opportunities, but they are not enough, and they are not in the reach of everyone. So, there are some institutions that are far ahead of others in their development of such programs. And I think there is a need to open potential to a wider group of people to those who are not the normal recipients of such opportunities to support them in that way as well, because we can't say that maybe the talent is limited to just a few institutions, I don't think so. But it is us being able to broaden the efforts to reach a wider talent. And we have tried to do this before in our previous Africa Open Lab initiatives. And we identified talents that were in universities or institutions that were not the typical big ones. And just by supporting one researcher in that institution, that they also subsequently supported others or helped build their teams. And so it's not just to say we are supporting one person, we are supporting them but it means apart from any funding that is available, whether it's funding for their project, or funding to take them to a conference, or to attend the workshop, we should be also focusing on they as well, being trainers, they as well, being mentors, they as well, trying to network more effectively, and bring in more teams together. So, I think there are various ways in which we can look at it, but in short, been able to support all the different aspects, look out for the key gaps. So we have learned that within that group, one of the key gaps is receiving statistical capabilities, and we say how do we then support that? Researchers, funders and so on, look for opportunities for addressing the key gaps, and being able to initiate programs or initiatives that can address these gaps?
Paul ADEPOJU 06:38Who qualifies as early career scientists?
Juliet Addo 06:42That is an interesting one and I know that we cannot get foolproof definition. But for now, this is somebody who is maximum of five years postdoc, and if they haven't done a PhD, then it's the equivalent of that, but they should at least have a basic degree. Somebody who has not got a major grant before. So, by major grant before we are talking about not succeeded in more than 100,000 pounds grant, who has published but it's not widely published. So maybe a couple of manuscripts from the work will be considered as early career. Is up to the stage of maybe not yet professor, not assistant professor. So maybe lecturer, at the level of lecturer will be considered an early career scientist.
Paul ADEPOJU 07:30Let's talk about the science ecosystem now. Let's look beyond the COVID pandemic and look at the current realities. I think in recent times, we are seeing a lot of advancements on the continent. But let's talk about getting the best out of African science probably localizing and rightly prioritizing the focus. We see a lot of initiatives come in and say, okay, we want to support scientists that are working in this line of research. And those kinds of initiatives come in, and yes, they can be able to achieve some of their set goals. But they may not be a true reflection of the local priority. And we've seen a lot of global initiatives too for instance, I think, Nature said it was reducing the cost of obligation for scientists in the low LMIC region. Yes, that was also heralded but it still seems to be probably we are nitpicking, cutting bits and pieces of the main crux of Africa Science Challenge. So, do you think breaking and attacking and addressing these issues fragmentally, is the way forward? Or you as a scientist, what do you still think can be fundamentally done, that could actually and actively accelerate the rate of growth of the continent size ecosystem?
Juliet Addo 09:00Thank you. I think we all agree that the challenge is huge, and it comes from different areas. So, the different disease areas, different gaps, local needs, and so on. So sometimes it's difficult to just decide that we are focusing on just one aspect and then when we finish with that one aspect, we move on to another. There has to be a way in which we holistically look at what the ecosystem is, what our key local needs are, and be able to prioritize them in terms of whichever way we want to do it, whether in terms of impact, and so on. But at the core of it should be our own system of prioritizing what our local needs are. So whatever help or assistance we get support we get, should come to support our defined needs, our defined research areas, and even if there are other interests, at least we also have our interests and we weave it into whatever else is being supported. I think it's fundamental.
Paul ADEPOJU 10:03Let's talk about probably, the global inequity. I think inequity is a big word that continues to be discussed, but it's also glaringly obvious in science. If you look at this global funding that are available for science research, even though we say that funding for research in Africa, is still abysmally low, when compared with Europe, North America and several other regions, is it possible to close this gap without aggressively encouraging government spending in research? And if you also look at the private sector itself, for instance, funding coming from several multinationals to support research, these companies, will they still be able to comparatively prioritize investing in research in Africa, over other regions, when private enterprises on the continent too are not making similar contributions to research? How do we make this balance without looking inward and directing actions inward, even though looking outward, may appear to be the more realistic solution in the short term?
Juliet Addo 11:13We all want to do good. And the organizations that are intending to fund really want to fund research in different areas. But if I come to the COVID example, when COVID struck and there was demand on every government, everyone then prioritized their own countries. And quickly, the sign of collaborations and partnerships dissolved for a moment and so everybody was left on their own. And, in fact, if Africa didn't rise, we would have been exposed and vulnerable and in such a situation. So, I think with that in mind, we should inherently be thinking as well of how we own our funding, how we own our research, how we own our priorities, and perhaps as a start the external support is needed. But it's quickly being able to move on from that to how we can also generate and sustain our own funding mechanisms.
Paul ADEPOJU 12:11So, let's look at when we talk about the brain drain problem in Africa. Sometimes the attention is usually on the health sector. How the continent is training doctors that are traveling abroad. How nurses, and even I think more recently, I heard countries like the UK, are now making it much easier for African teachers to move to the UK to practice. But we are not seeing that attention on the science and research ecosystem. And because many countries in Africa, some of these world class facilities are not available, and access to global tools are not available, which simply still means that if the opportunities are available, researchers from the continent would always look abroad for these better opportunities and better skills, better tools to be able to do research. So, my two-part question is this, why are we not talking a lot about Africa research brain drain? And how do we strike a balance in avoiding brain drain in Africa, and yet ensuring that our researchers are able to have access to the best tools?
Juliet Addo 13:24So, this is a very deep question, because I think, I will not say, and I probably do not know that we are not making enough noise about the fact that the brain drain goes across the research landscape as well. And it's not just the doctors, and the nurses, and now the teachers. But in fact, the scientists are also leaving the continent. I think it's drain of any kind being lost from Africa after training is not really an encouraging trend. And we need to be able to pinpoint what the challenges are, what is leading to this drain, and how we can be able to stop it, it's very difficult to stop someone from going, if it's because they are going to improve on their skills, or they are in a situation where they are not incentivized to work. So, it's about institutions, academic institutions, research institutions, etcetera; beginning to look at what they could do to retain the scientists they're training. And I think sometimes, some of these are just providing the facilities and even if it's the absence of facilities that lead people to want to go external to just get access. Is there any way of arranging institutions actually arranging this? So that it is perhaps regional kinds of collaborations of support, even if it's external, north-south, being able to arrange it within the institution and make sure that there is provision for these academics to feel that their interest is also being considered, they are being prioritized, there are efforts to make sure that they are given the right tools and skills that they need to be able to develop. And once that is available, they will attract the right talent, and not only attract them, but they will be able to retain them. And it might be that there needs to be some kind of supporting mechanism to start with, to be able to let that become effective and be implemented in a realistic way. And over the years, I'm sure a lot of efforts have been up and up. But I've seen many young talents being retained as well, just because they got the right mentor, just because they got the right support, they needed to be able to work on the skill sets that they had. And they're not just being pressured to do loads of maybe teaching or loads of something else that wasn't their key interest. So, it's about taking their own professional development as a core part and getting them the support that is needed to be able to make sure that they grow in their career.
Paul ADEPOJU 16:02Looking back at your own personal journey, when you're in school, going through the different stages of education, to where research currently is on the continent. Is there progress? Or is there retrogression? And how do you think the continent can get to an ideal state that you believe, you personally believe the continent can actually occupy on the global science landscape?
Juliet Addo 16:32So, I must say that there definitely has been great progress. When I look back from my time in medical school. I started in 1990 and all the way now definitely has been a lot of progress. And in just even in the HIV field, and the kind of HIV in my time in medical school was a death sentence. And within my lifetime, I have seen it transform from that to a chronic disease that can be managed. A lot of research that was done, even if it wasn't initially led by African scientists, I think a lot of research has subsequently been done in the continent and there have been labs that have been established, there have been a lot of progress in that area. So just looking at HIV as an example, I know that it is possible that the continents can develop in research and then reset infrastructure and be able to deal with the other infections that perhaps we are still not at the root of, but which we are close to and be able to do a lot. So, I have seen labs that have come in place, which we didn't have when we were in school. I have seen lecturers develop, I've seen academic programs and modules and so on all of it being initiated within the continent and I think these are attesting to the fact that there has been development. The pace of it, and whether there is room for more for it to be more rapid, I don't know. But I think these are steps in the right direction.
Paul ADEPOJU 18:07So, if I will go back to what you say that it seems as if looking at the progress, the progress has continued to be tied with donor and foreign support. Will this continue to be the way, or should we come to terms that we cannot grow science on the continent without international support?
Juliet Addo 18:27We should get to the point where it's Africa science for African solutions and I think it's possible to do it, it's possible to prioritize that. We have enough talents. We probably have enough resources, and we should be able to do that on our own. We might need some help to start with, but we will grow into doing it on our own.
